Hurray!

I like Biden; I almost deferred first year law in 1988 to go and work for his campaign.  Then came the "I am more intelligent than you are" gaffe, and the "I am a miner's son" speech copied from Neil Kinnock.  NEIL FUCKING KINNOCK.  I went on with law school.  The man lost to Dukakis, for God's sake.  I was about to say he is a walking gaffe, but then realised he has a permanent foot in his mouth, which makes him a hopping, leaping gaffe.

Every time I hear Biden as VP, I am reminded of Luke Skywalker at the end of Empire.  

I hold to the belief that Biden is Obama's best choice for vice president.

As you've already stated, he's kind of a working stiff, which gives him credibility with Joe Lunchbucket, and he's a foreign policy and homeland security heavyweight, which gives him credibility with Elites. He's a respected, "seasoned hand," which could reassure seniors, and yet his shoot-from-the-lip candor might play well with younger voters.

He also happens to be blessed with a razor sharp mind that could be very effective in debates. (Certainly Rudy Giuliani found that out the hard way.)

I think it really comes down to whether Obama feels any chemistry with the guy. If so, Biden really should be at the top of his list.

These VP watch series are sort of making you guys look a bit amateur.  And I say that as a deep admirer or the Stump.  I guess you have to be right once, unless you're not.  A Biden watch will get you a lot of comment traffic since Joe has a fan base here (and nowhere else), but this might be a good time to focus on *policy* instead of idle veepstakes blogging.   Both candidates are getting drawn into discussions of what they'd do as President and not just on the big issues but the day to day stuff.

Funny thing is, this TNR.com thingy has these longer bits of writing: I heard somebody call them "articles" one time.  And oddly enough, those "article" thingys have this funny little habit of getting into policy and such.  So, you might actually try an article thingy if all you want to do is wonk off on policy...

And, on the whole, that was a pretty decent smackdown of Jim DeMini from Biden.  As far as senate workings go, the committee as a whole is Biden's, and it's perfectly appropriate for him to operate hearings as he sees fit, and he eloquently chides DeMini for forgetting who's in charge.  Guess Biden's just fine at controlling himself when he sits down and writes a letter.

Wait, why would VP Joe Biden be like Luke Skywalker at the end of the Empire Strikes Back? Is Barack Obama going to cut off his hand and reveal himself to be Biden's father? I have some concerns about the Obama/Biden relationship, but that hasn't been one of them up until now.

I don't get the analogy, but I am intrigued.

That was 20 years ago, icarusr.  He's learned a lot. Yeah, he makes occassional gaffes, or whatever, but that clearly isn't a barrier to being elected.   He will make a great attack dog for Barack and will destroy- just destroy- anyone the GOP puts up in a debate.  Can you imagine him going one-on-one with Mitt?   Holy gods...

icarus, I'm confused.  Every time you hear of Biden as VP, your hand gets chopped off and you plunge through an airshaft, where you are rescued through psychic connection to your sister, after which a prosthesis is attached and you and she (your sister, not the prosthesis) stare out into space, vowing to free your compatriot from the carbonite in which he has been imprisoned?  

Because that's what happens when I think of Richardson as VP.

Noam - faire un oeuf, we hear you re. the blog aspect. But could you please, PLEASE ask your overlords to enable comments and real, and real-time, discussions to take place next to the serious tnr.com fare? The articles are overwhelmed with trolls and nutcase non-subscribers. There's no formatting for posts, which in any case are so delayed as to be useless for any real discussion. Most of us post here next to the tnr.com blog-ephemera _because tnr.com offers no other place to gather or have a meaningful discussion_.

Give us a working comments feature on the meaty articles and we'll ignore every one of your Webb (Clark) (Nunn) (Hagel) (Olbermann) (Michael Moore) Watch blog-entries, forever. Deal?

The dangers of arguing by analogy ...

No, more like Luke's primal scream when he hears that Darth thingummybob is his Father.

Bone: it would be neat to see Mitt being sliced into small pieces by Biden; I will grant you that.

You go get em' Noam, I like the VP speculation.  Besides, that smackdown Biden handed DeMint was a thing of beauty.

I say it should be Biden or Zinni, for regular-guy cred and also the national security stuff (and because I'm totally in the tank for Mickey Kaus).

tep,

I had been inclined to agree with you completely re improving the main (i.e., meaty) article comments until the other day when I wandered over to said main articles and checked out the (day-old, of course) comments on some or another Obama piece.

Whoa. The comments were, um, eye-opening to say the least. I actually felt a twinge of sympathy for CanWest before I gathered my humble sack of brain cells and ran back to the Plank as fast as my fingers could take me. It takes real skill, I suppose, to discover a common denominator lower than what crawls around Kos and LGF.

So, back at the Plank, reading the intelligent, largely courteous parry-and-thrust amongst our fellow Plankton, I suddenly realized CanWest's game: make us appreciate what we have! Mom used to employ this with some success when she'd plop a pile of gray, overboiled vegetables on my dinner plate and admonish me to eat it because "There are children in [Armenia, India, Honduras, et al.] who have nothing to eat for their supper. Are you listening to me, Billy?"

We must, therefore, ignore the irony of thoughtfully discussing Scarlett Johansson and the like while the substantive pieces are analyzed by folks who, at precisely 2 p.m. each afternoon, receive a tap on the shoulder from an orderly who hands them a pill and a small Dixie cup of water. Rather, it is with much unjustified guilt and self-loathing that we should continue to appreciate and contribute to the Plank, Stump, and their siblings, all the while stealing a furtive glance at the main articles on the landing page and think, "There but for the grace of CanWest..."

drdannyu, hah great laugh

"small Dixie cup" - priceless, thanks, Bill. As with every great writer, it's that minor telling detail that makes your stuff sing.

Re grace-o-G-d, I used to watch Jerry Ford stumble and revise my mother's apothegm: "There but for the god of Grace goes he." My mother was not amused.

DrDan, that is SO not Richardson as VP.

If you'd been paying the slightest attention to recent internal machinations in the Democratic Party, you'd know that Richardson as VP is appearing with the Trapp Family Singers at the Salzburg Music Festival under the strict gaze of humorless, uncredited Nazis before escaping over the Alps into Switzerland.

Cheeses, do we have to write everything down for you?

I'm so confused.  So very, very confused.  I thought the Trapp Family Singers over the Alps was Webb.  But would that make Ingrid Bergman flying off while Bogard befriends Claude Rains Nunn or Hagel?

Dan, you have to go back to the beginning, to days of yore ("Birth of a Nation":Edwards), then work your way forward.

Tedious, to be sure, but at least that way you avoid the dreaded "Easy Rider":Kathleen Sebelius quagmire that's ensnared far more astute observers than me.

(Anyone needing proof that the GOP is in for a long night on November 4 should note that fully a third of McCain's pledged delegates, having failed to do their homework, are locked into a "Happy Gilmore":Sonny Perdue mobius with little hope of escape.)

I see Peter Beinart is talking up Gore for the veep. Maybe, I haven't been paying attention but is that really likely?

Would be pretty cool if it was.

Iggy, I would be really, really surprised if Gore wanted to take time off from polishing his Oscar and Nobel Peace Prize to be second banana to Barack Obama.  Whatever rumblings I've heard (and, to be honest, they're faint, vague, and poorly recalled) seemed to indicate that he's not interested.

I care not which one of those bozos y'all pick, but I will say that this is the funniest thread I'veread in many moons.

Thanks, all.... now where's that Dixie cup?

I don't know Dan, Gore the ego is typical target here in TNR Talkback, but I believe the man has a soul and would relish the chance, not to be VP, but COC of energy and environment. If Obama does want to create an admin from "all of the talents", and if he can find space for a Republican Sec of Def, then there's no reason why he wouldn't offer it to Gore. No, in fact he should beg him.

And it would be a sight to behold to read the TNR scribes lactate in ecstasy over that ticket.

I think a giant step for improving communication here might be to format it more as a forum and not a long list of replies.  I'm referring to a threaded discussion with nested folders (each topic is top-level) and we could see dozens of 'Subjects' per page, click on the titles of interest and they'd expand (think of a file manager in a computer).

Too many issues dribble off and it isn't for lack of interest.  We see a few topics a day and to hunt them down and keep the discussion going means navigating through several pages.

Plus, there could be several semi-permanent subjects which would stay at the top of the threads.

I realize this isn't a discussion group but it is a tighter community than many blogs and TNR would be well served if they enhanced the experience to closer match the style of communication. This isn't a post and run group...

Oh, I'm OK with the VP topics & under 'my' system each prospective candidate would have an fixed position for easy access as the race evolves.

Iggy, I can see a cabinet position.  I would find VP surprising.  But what the hell do I know?  I'm just some schmoe.

Well I'm just some annoying blaggard Dan. Kindered spirits are we. And anyway: wisdom the

gods have made, and no man shall live by its light, for it and the hail and the rain and the thunder follow a way that is deadly to mortal things.

Stay healthy.

Well put, Iggy.  But I have to agree with the good Doctor Dan on this- I think there can be some kind of high-profile announcment that Gore will be an Enviro and Energy Czar (no!  Not czar! But you know what I mean).   Maybe even a new cabinet post.  But I don't think he cares much for the tedium of elections, debates, endless speeches, etc.  It isn't a second-bannana/ego thing, I think, just a tempremental distaste for the grind of actually running- something most people share, I imagine.  

Noam linked to a letter Biden wrote in defense of Obama--and then suggested that he’d have some definite

Well look make him the Pope of Deep Greens if you want. Maybe as VP he would steal some of the Hope spotlight but Obama should listen, carefully to him. At least then me and Marty could hold hands for a post or two. (I'm a clinical masochist Bone, have you heard? Not sure if I should be proud or ashamed to be honest.)  

I love Joe Biden, but he's a gaffe machine who never got above single digits in the primaries and comes from a state that's already in the bag. Don't be ridiculous.

Evan Bayh is the best choice. Unlike bloated has-been loser Al Gore, and doddering relics like Nunn and Hamilton, Bayh is a young, attractive two-term Governor and Senator from an important red state he could bring; serves on the Armed Services and Select Intelligence Committees; chairs the Foreign Trade and Security Subcommittee; is a veteran, flawless performer on Sunday talk-show tv; and has the kind of Mid-Western White Boy chops that compliment Obama perfectly. A stalwart Hillary supporter and DLC principal, he's got a voting record and history that will appeal to the Independent and sensible Republican voters Obama needs to attract.

Bayh's the guy.

I question Bayh's debating abilities. Does he have it in him to be an occasional attack dog?

He's better than that. I've seen him dozens of times on shows like Meet the Press paired off with a Republican Senator, and he's never failed to carry the day in my opinion. He does it in a very agreeable, reasonable way that is not only extremely effective, but is a great match with Obama's meme of a "new politics" that breaks away from the super-partisan attack dog model.

On Veep speculation, if Noam is still reading, don't undersell yourself ("just a blog.")  My point is that this blog is so good that if you do speculate on veeps, be more sparing and bring us some more inside info or scoop reporting.  The internet is already saturated with breathless discussions of veep candidates that so ill informed and meaningless that they waste time and space.  I think both the Plank and Stump have crossed the bliss point that balances quality with quantity.

Late to the Gore discussion but one minor obstacle to your scenarios envisaging any offical position for Gore is his role, IIUC, as a general partner in a Silicon Valley VC firm that is placing huge bets on green technologies. The guy's cynicism may be breathtaking-- "Listen up, America! Time to put $3 trillion in public funds into my partners' pet projects"-- but he's not stupid. So long as a fawning press ignores this massive conflict of interest between his public persona and his financial interests, he stands to make gazillions.