Really, Mr. Cajun? Who was it who accused Bill RIchardson of being Judas to Hillary's Jesus? I guess he would know better than anyone about igniting. You assail Obama supporters for their position for months and then scold them for not giving money to the source of these attacks? Is there seriously something wrong with you, Mr. Carville?

Mr. big brass "cojones" Carville and his professionals lost the primaries to the said "Amateurs" and their matchsticks. Well, if something ignites, we'll all be burning on our way to hell in a hand basket.

Hillary ran up her debt in the last weeks of the campaign when it was obvious to everyone except Harriet Christian and a rowboat full of others that she had a zero percent chance of winning the nomination. She spent that money bashing Obama to prove some point about how she can't be pushed out of a race before she's ready to go, no one's going to tell her what to do, you'd better kiss my supporters' asses because we're not going anywhere.

Gee, I can't imagine why Obama fans are hesitant to fill her coffers. It's stunning, Mr. Carville, that they don't want to foot the bill for her needless Obama bashing fest. It's a real poser. Someone call Encyclopedia Brown!

He's just nuts. So nuts that if you cut the nuts out there'd be nothing left. Wasn't he going on and on about how if Obama won the nomination he, Nutso, would be the loudest supporter? Now he's blaming the campaign [and making creepy threats like a match-happy hophead from an AIP juvie movie] for the lack of desire of Obama donors to pay off Clinton's debts; It's Obama's fault that Clinton is in the hole, and it's Obama's fault that his heavy donors don't feel like paying for her campaign.

Someone older than me or a historian that isn't Sean Wilenz: Is this even precedented at all? Has the winner ever been somehow responsible for paying the loser's debts?

Michael - I've noticed more of these "picking at the scab" stories in the last couple of days. I know it looks like a long, tedious summer of campaign coverage, but these stories just feel strained at this point.  Carville will always say offensive things on que, but its like fish in a barrel - what is newsworthy about it but the tittlilation factor?  

It feels like you all are ginning this up again out of boredom.  Why not poke a stick in the monkey cage, get them fighting again?  It's got to be more interesting than another Mike Murphy story.  But nothing has changed but the focus of the press.  Let's move along.

So there aren't any Hillarylanders playing with matches?

miceelf, it's playing with matches for Obama's supporters to fail to show Hillary sufficient "respect" to donate money they might otherwise use to help actual Democratic candidates for office beat Republicans this year to help non-candidate Hillary retire her debt instead. I mean, honestly, you can see the Cajun's point: What the hell are Obama donors thinking, marshaling their money to defeat actual Republicans in actual elections in 2008, instead of just handing it all over to Hillary so she can have an easier time running for president again in 2012? Short-sighted judases.

But when Hillaristas continue to hold out the implicit and sometimes overt threat that they will not support Obama, or might even support McCain, that's not playing with matches. That's playing with gunpowder.  That's how passive-aggressive pathology works: You use your willingness to hurt your own supposed interests to hold others who actually hold those interests hostage to your whims. It's the fact that you're willing to throw handfuls of gunpowder around that makes it so dangerous for the other guy to play with matches.

Frankly, there are all these anecdotes about Hil's more rabid supporters donating to McCain, PUMA, and voting against all their interests because boohoo the Dem party screwed them somehow, let THEM help her with her debt. F**king A! Personally, I would give Hillary $2300 except it would go to pay that real f**khead Penn...  She's got years to pay this off, and she can use her Senate campaign to pay it down, and her husband asked Obama to kiss his ass, so frankly I'm not feeling very f**king generous.

I love James Carville. He was instrumental in engineering the most ingenious and successful Democrat electoral exercise since FDR. Besides, he's my homeboy.

With all due respect to psantilla, I suggest you leave the castration cracks to Jessie. Carville's offhand remarks on TV about some story in the NYT's  shouldn't be taken as a Serious Policy Statement.

In my view, somebody needs to give this guy a job. Hopefully it will be the Obama campaign, where he's fully capable of providing some adult supervision to what is clearly a superb organization that could make good use of more insight into the kind of blue-collar Dems Carville instinctively, and scientifically, understands.

And bring Evan Bayh as VP--he's a two-term red state Governor and Senator who serves on  Armed Services and the Select Committee on Intelligence; and is Chairman of the Subcommittee on International Trade and Finance. Plus he's got perfect Mid-Western White Boy chops--an experienced and skillful performer on national TV, he could bring Indiana while helping significantly in many other states with swing voters.

I completely fail to understand why anyone imagines an Obama supporter would want to donate to reduce Clinton's debt.  She gambled she could come from impossibly far behind using money Bill had earned prostituting his former position, and lost.  I'm supposed to be sympathetic to this, and having scraped together some cash for a political donation, put it there, instead of in the real race, or a House or Senate race in my state?  I earn a good deal less in a year than Bill Clinton gets for a one hour speech - I actually have to pay attention to where I spend and donate, and losers are, by construction, not on the top of my list.

yes, why would an Obama supporter want to pay to reduce Clinton's debt, not only because she doesn't deserve it, but because that money is better spent contributing to Obama's general election race.

whoa, I think Mike Crowley is misinterpreting the remarks, Carville was referring to Obama people talking about the reasons why they aren't, not that they aren't. (like Mark Penn doesn't deserve a penny, etc.) It is a huge difference. It is one thing not to pay down the debt, it is another to trash talk about why you are not paying the debt.

The Clinton's lost! Why aren't they bending over backwards for the Democratic nominee? Their continued sense of entitlement is infuriating.

Originally I was of two minds on this: on the one hand, Hillary had taken nasty attacks her entire career to make it to the top, fought for Democratic causes, and won a hefty 49% or whatever it was of primary voters, so I say to myself, you know what, she deserves some credit and she can say what she wants.

But then, I think about it some more and realize the Clinton's would never, never, never be as gracious and as patient with a loser as Obama has been, so my sympathy for their position, and massive campaign debt, has greatly subsided.

What a goofball. Obama supporters might be a bit reluctant to dump their hard earned cash to Hillary can pay back her bill to that union-busting, Colombia Free trade lobbying, Karen Hughs hiring, megabucks holding and campaign losing former consultant Mark Penn.  

If Hillary can use democratic contributions to pay down her presidential-gambling debt, can Mcfilp-flop use republican money to pay his gambling debts?

blackton, how can they talk about why they don't want to pay the debt if the reason is Mark Penn, and they feel he did not earn his money or whatever? If that's how they feel, how do they avoid "trash talk"? Also, that isn't even anti-HRC trash talk, so I can't see how it would inflame the PUMAs.

I still think Carville's nuts, and Robert, I wasn't suggesting castration, I was making a pun on Jackson's comment, that is, if you cut out the crazy from Carville there wouldn't be anything left. And he should not be anywhere near Obama's campaign. He has no self control. He's entertaining, though. He should have his own talk show. Or spot on a panel.

"Entertaining" is one of the principle attributes Obama brings, Psanti. If we're going to have to listen to endless re-packaging of the same policies, I prefer that it at least be entertaining. And Carville is crazy like a fox. The Dems need some of this kind of crazy instead of the kind on offer in the nutroots. Who's your daddy?

Thanks to blackton for cutting to the chase. Carville is performing in a hall of mirrors here. Trash talk and innuendo abounds. He said what?? Nice catch.

I'm absolutely on board for making sure Mark Penn doesn't get a penny he doesn't have to pull out of a spittoon from anyone except the Clintons. They should pay his bill in full, then maroon him on a desert island with Bob Schrum.

thanks Bob, I saw it last night on TV and it didn't seem unreasonable at all. I am not going to contribute to the Hillary campaign, but there is no reason for me to say why I am not. And I doubt anyone is going to call some of Obama's supporters and berate them for not ponying up.

psantillana, if when you were younger a guy asked you out, you could say no and no one would mind, but if you go around telling everyone why you said no...

Wait a minute, blackie. Why would you think psantillana would have to hark back to when she was younger?  I'd ask her out sight unseen, and I'm not as desperate as I was when I was younger.

Bob, I think she is married, she had a baby not too long back.

blackton: if I said to the guy - "no thanks, I like you but I hate your skinhead friends and you never leave their side", then what's wrong with that? In fact it saves face for the guy I rejected if anything. And it's true to boot. I mean about Penn. And: I'm not epiccutio! But I like her posts, so keep confusing us.

RP: aw, shucks!

This is rich coming from Carville. I'm sick and tired of the Clinton camp acting like they can call the shots because of Hilarys 18 million supporters if they love her so much let them pay her debt. OBama supporters doesnt owe her squat never before have I heard of a candidate paying off another candidates debt its ludicrious and Clintonistas think that they have a right to act they hold the cards when they dont. Personally I think he can win without the die hard Clintonistas. The rest have common sense.

Carol

So where are all a Clinton supporters to help retire their debt now? I remember Clinton bragging about some little kid in Kentucky selling his bicycle and his toys and giving the money to the Clinton campaign.  Fucking shameless opportunistic and predatory that's what I call that kind of manipulation.

So where are all these Puma's, don't they have their girls back.  Why don't these poorly informed working-class shlubs that Clinton spent those millions to con and work into a frenzy, sell their cars and homes to retire the Clinton debt, what's the matter with them, don't they believe in their candidate anymore?

Here's an idea how about Bill and Hillary cough up the money out of their own damn bank account, they've got the cash, they can afford it.  Poor Chelsea her parents will only leave her 150 million in there will instead of 170 million.  To my mind it's becoming more and more of a moral imperative that the Clintons to pay for the defeat they engineered.  That really is the only thing people liked Clinton's understand, being made to pay through the nose.  

How about the Clintons donate another 200 or 300 million from the Clinton foundation to help get the American people quality health-care.  What's more important us or some overblown and rather undeserved legacy that will do nothing more than promote the beloved Clinton brand.