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COLUMNISTS
TODAY'S STORIES
11.09.2008
Today's Polls: Palin's A Hit Everywhere -- But The Electoral College

 An avalanche of polling today, but a consistent theme emerges:

And what is that theme? Well, it's that the popular vote and the Electoral College are significantly diverging. Although the Republicans seem to be polling stronger than they were in the pre-convention period almost everywhere, the differences are much larger in traditionally red states, particularly in the South and the rural West (Colorado and Nevada, by the way, are not rural states). Basically, I think the Republicans are getting the evangelical vote, and a significant fraction of the Perot vote.

Unfortunately, these are not particularly useful votes for them to have in terms of the electoral math. Here is a comparison of our projected margins of victory on August 26th -- the Tuesday of the Democratic convention, before polling had any chance to take Michelle Obama's opening night speech into effect -- with our projections today in a select group of states that have been polled since the RNC ended.

State   8/26          9/11           Change
NH Obama +1.4 Obama +3.3 Obama +1.9
WV McCain +8.1 McCain +7.4 Obama +0.7
ME Obama +12.9 Obama +13.0 Obama +0.1
FL McCain +3.5 McCain +3.8 McCain +0.3
NJ Obama +8.0 Obama +7.5 McCain +0.5
OH McCain +0.7 McCain +1.3 McCain +0.6
NM Obama +2.2 Obama +1.5 McCain +0.7
MI Obama +3.0 Obama +2.0 McCain +1.0
WI Obama +7.1 Obama +5.8 McCain +1.3
CO Obama +1.2 McCain +0.4 McCain +1.6
PA Obama +6.3 Obama +4.6 McCain +1.7
NV McCain +0.5 McCain +2.2 McCain +1.7
==============AVERAGE: McCAIN +2.1 ===============
VA McCain +0.6 McCain +3.1 McCain +2.5
ND McCain +9.1 McCain +12.5 McCain +3.4
NC McCain +3.8 McCain +7.5 McCain +3.7
MS McCain +13.4 McCain +17.4 McCain +4.0
MT McCain +3.5 McCain +8.3 McCain +4.8
GA McCain +8.5 McCain +13.5 McCain +5.0
WA Obama +11.5 Obama +6.3 McCain +5.2
ID McCain +19.1 McCain +30.0 McCain +11.9
AK McCain +6.6 McCain +20.4 McCain +13.8

McCain's gain in our popular vote projection has been 2.1 points. Note, however, that his gains have been less than that in essentially all of the most important swing states, including Ohio, Michigan, Florida, Colorado, Pennsylvania and New Hampshire. Only Virginia is on the other side of the line, and then only barely so.

As a result of all this, the Electoral College remains too close to call, even though McCain has a 1-2 point advantage in the popular vote. Obama now has an 8.4 percent chance of winning the Electoral College while losing the popular vote, which is far and away the highest that this number has been all year. And that number may get larger rather than smaller, once polling filters in from other red states like Texas, Nebraska and South Carolina. Palin may have been a brilliant VP selection -- I think even Palinophobes like me have to concede that right now McCain's looking pretty savvy -- but some of that sheen is taken off by her somewhat lackluster effect on the Electoral College.

--Nate Silver 

Posted: Thursday, September 11, 2008 6:48 PM with 18 comment(s)

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aeromonas said:

Factor in the gap in ground-level organization in ALL of the swing states, along with a big Obama-favoring question mark surrounding black turnout in FL, OH, MI, NC, PA and VA and Clinton's "Obama will win" statement looks more substantial than the usual bluster.

September 11, 2008 6:55 PM

Eos said:

During the primaries, Obama almost always ran behind his polling, didn't he?

September 11, 2008 7:13 PM

icarusr said:

Bah, he's a lightweight politician, wrong-footed by Palin.  Who cares about the Electoral College?  Palin wants to invade Russia and understands that the only issue in national sexurity is drilling now, drilling here, and getting pregnant.

September 11, 2008 7:26 PM

JEFF FREY said:

Eos, I think Obama usually came out with more votes than the polls suggested. Remember all the "Reverse Bradley Effect" and "Reverse Reverse Bradley Effect" posts Noam made? I don't know if it was because people were not fully honest or because the actual turnout did not match the polling model (more young voter, more African-American voters).

I note that the latest Alaska poll brought McCain's margin there to about the same as Bush's in 2004. So I think Nate's point is valid. McCain has made huge gains in the states where he was going to win anyway, and small gains in the states that matter. The big gains won't be reversed, but so what. The small gains can be reversed. Democrats: stop wringing your hands, there are 7 weeks to go. It's nearly a dead heat.

September 11, 2008 7:40 PM

mcorey.geo said:

<<

Factor in the gap in ground-level organization in ALL of the swing states, along with a big Obama-favoring question mark surrounding black turnout in FL, OH, MI, NC, PA and VA

>>

Might I add, another Obama-favoring question mark surrounding youth turnout. Before the Republican posters bite my head off, I didn't say an Obama-favoring answer, but an Obama-favoring question.

September 11, 2008 7:44 PM

jacksondyer said:

So Mc Cain will get the votes and Obama will get the Presidency.

That should make the Republicans as cooperative as the Democrats were under Bush.

September 11, 2008 8:20 PM

jacksondyer said:

icarusr said:  "Bah, he's a lightweight politician, wrong-footed by Palin.  Who cares about the Electoral College?  Palin wants to invade Russia and understands that the only issue in national sexurity is drilling now, drilling here, and getting pregnant."

You are repeating nonsense you read on website.

try listening to the whole interview.

The NY Times in a condescending story has an analysis of a segement of that interview:

"Palin Interview: She Didn’t Blink When Asked to Run"

thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/.../palin-interview-she-didnt-blink-when-asked-to-run

People should read more than the headline.

September 11, 2008 8:24 PM

ChanRobt said:

This may all be true.  But, I believe I read today that McCain was 4 points ahead in the national Gallup poll.

Only three presidents have lost the popular vote but won the electoral vote.  But has any president ever won by 4% in the popular vote and still lost the electoral?

September 11, 2008 8:36 PM

stgla said:

I suspect a lot of disaffected Republicans were just looking for a reason to like McCain and dislike Obama.  Now, thanks to the nasty, snarling Republicans they can base their vote on McCain's having survived a POW camp and having a hot running mate versus the black guy who spent all his life stirring up trouble with the black folks in Chicago "organizing" communities.

September 11, 2008 10:55 PM

aeromonas said:

Chan, of course not.  But lots of presidents have won after having trailed by >4% in national tracking polls at some stage, a recent example being George W. Bush.

September 12, 2008 12:49 AM

jacksondyer said:

stgla said:  "I suspect a lot of disaffected Republicans were just looking for a reason to like McCain and dislike Obama.  Now, thanks to the nasty, snarling Republicans they can base their vote on McCain's having survived a POW camp and having a hot running mate versus the black guy who spent all his life stirring up trouble with the black folks in Chicago "organizing" communities"

Nice try stigla or stikla,

Obama was and is no rebel he was and is a Chicago who made up very well for himself by joining the political machine there.

September 12, 2008 12:53 AM

ChanRobt said:

aeromonas writes, re can you be 4% ahead in the popular vote and still lose the electoral, "...Chan, of course not.  But lots of presidents have won after having trailed by >4% in national tracking polls at some stage..."

OK, well then that explain the widely reported panic among Democrats and maybe the Obama camp itself about his trailing in popularity.

Yes, of course Obama can win the national vote back.  but, if he doesn't, or trails even more, then that belies the premise of the article that everything is looking rosy for him in the electoral college.

September 12, 2008 2:39 AM

Wandreycer1 said:

You're absolutely right stgla, as usual.

September 12, 2008 7:57 AM

satyendra said:

Jackson Dyer, in what way did Obama join the Chicago political machine? He was an IL State Senator, based in Springfield.

September 12, 2008 9:43 AM

mkricaurte said:

electoral college analysts say that the map follows if a candidate wins the pop vote by 2% or more (though I have only heard and read this, never seen the statistics to back this statement)

so Obama has to close the pop vote gap to <2% to have a chance at the electoral college victory

if Obama wins the electoral college (and the presidency) but McCain the pop vote, there may just be a ground swell to eliminate the college. This would actually eliminate a GOP advantage in presidential politics. It'll be interesting...

September 12, 2008 9:59 AM

Eos said:

Jeff Frey:

Obama may have occasionally done better thatn his polls, but I thought he was usually behind them.

The Bradley Effect is often spoken of as though it is an indicator of racism, but it is not. It is actually what is called a "social desirability" effect, whereby people respond to a question with what they think is the socially desirable answer, even if it does not match what they actually think or do. It is akin to overstating your income on a questionnaire or overestimating how long it has been since you quit smoking.

Voting for a black candidates may be the socially desirable and politically correct answer and therefore the support for black candidates may get overestimated by polling. This is not racism but a form of political correctness. Obama may get more of this than do other black candidates because he has been so "cool" that saying you are voting for him has more cahet than saying you are voting for Hillary or McCain.

September 12, 2008 10:16 AM

TheOneIsHere2008 said:

Please

Barack Obama is not going to lose the pop vote by three percentage points and win the Electoral College...That's like playing poker and hoping you get a Royal Flush...

Dumb...Dunb...Dumb...

You have to go back to Tilden V Hayes to get a situation close to that and I doubt they had the most accurate counts  in those days...

If Obama doesn't change the dynamic we will find ourselves ruled on 1/21/09 by the most right wing couple since Ferdinand and Imelda Marcos...

September 12, 2008 11:05 AM

The Stump said:

If you missed it, Nate Silver&#39;s latest calculations suggest we may be headed in that direction, with

September 12, 2008 2:38 PM