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COLUMNISTS
TODAY'S STORIES
28.01.2008
Why Kennedy's Endorsement Matters

How will Ted Kennedy's endorsement affect the presidential race? The debate is already well underway. Skeptics note that endorsements don't have the same weight they did a few decades ago, when more voters took their cues from party leaders. Al Gore's endorsement of Howard Dean four years ago certainly didn't deliver the nomination.

But Kennedy's progressive record on economic issues, not to mention his family name, might give him unusual clout with older, working-class white voters -- ones who, until now, have strongly preferred Hillary Clinton. Kennedy is also said to be popular with Latinos, thanks in part to his history of championing liberal immigration reforms and to Robert Kennedy's early support of Cesar Chavez.

This is where the timing of Kennedy's announcement -- and peculiar dynamics of this race -- could prove critical. Latinos, who have strongly favored Clinton so far, are well-represented in the big states voting on February 5. And while Kennedy's endorsement alone surely isn't enough to swing a whole state like New Jersey or California, it might be enough to shift enough votes to change delegate counts -- which is what really matters at this point. 

Remember, Democratic primaries aren't winner-take-all. Even if Clinton wins more votes in the biggest coastal states, a strong second-place showing by Obama in those places -- combined with winnings in Illinois and other interior states -- could give him the majority of the day's delegates.  (Or at least keep the count pretty close.)

Of course, all of that is just guesswork, based on polling numbers that may not be accurate and assumptions about voter attitudes that may not be correct.

But while I can't say with confidence whether people will pay attention to Kennedy's endorsement, I feel certain that they should pay attention -- because Kennedy's embrace speaks directly to the misgivings (expressed, on more than one occasion, by me) that Obama was insufficiently committed to a progressive policy agenda and that he lacked the savvy to enact an ambitious, necessarily controversial agenda.

Consider: No member of Congress has a longer, truer record of championing liberal causes than Kennedy. He was fighting for universal coverage back when Hillary Clinton was still in law school. And when the times have called for confrontation, Kennedy has not flinched.  Look back at 1995 and 1996, when programs like Medicare were under seige from a new and aggressive Republican majority, and you'll find Kennedy leading the counter-attack.  In August 1996, after the Democrats had finally beaten back the Gingrich revolutionaries, then-Minority Leader Tom Daschle (now an Obama booster, by the way) said of Kennedy "I don't know anybody who contributed more." (Link $)

Still, Kennedy also has a strong pragmatic streak. It's hard to think of anybody in Congress who has produced as much important legislation, even in times when Democrats were out of power. (Henry Waxman is the only name that comes quickly to mind.)  To accomplish this, Kennedy has sometimes embraced such unlikely allies as George W. Bush and Mitt Romney in order to push for such imperfect laws as No Child Left Behind and the recent Massachusetts health care reforms.  But if those efforts have annoyed liberal allies now and then, they have generally served the liberal cause well. Just ask anybody covered under the State Children's Health Insurance Program (S-CHIP), a bipartisan program from the late 1990s for which Kennedy was heavily responsible.  (In fairness, both Clintons had a little something to do with that, too.)

To be sure, it's reasonable and necessary to ask whether Obama will can strike such a similarly deft balance between confrontation and compromise -- a question Paul Krugman poses in an important column today.  It's also fair to treat skeptically the true meaning of any endorsement, given how frequently they reflect petty politics or personal strategic considerations rather than considered judgements about qualifications for office.

But it's not clear how Kennedy stands to gain politically by antagonizing Clinton, who remains the presumptive front-runner.  Nor is there evidence of personal animus between the two.  On the contrary, every account I've ever heard suggests Kennedy has a high regard for Clinton, going back to her days as First Lady. 

So my hunch -- and, to be clear, it's just a hunch -- is that this is mostly the real thing. It may reflect Kennedy's anger over the recent campaign tactics, about which Kennedy apparently complained directly to the Clintons. It may reflect Kennedy's sense that Obama has tapped into the same idealism that JFK once did -- a feeling the former president's daughter, Caroline Kennedy, wrote about in her own Obama endorsement on the Times op-ed page yesterday. But I also think it reflects Kennedy's belief that Obama will ultimately serve the liberal cause better than Clinton could.  And given that Kennedy has seen both presidential contenders up close, as Brian Beutler notes, that judgment has meaning.

Naturally, Kennedy's endorsement carries some risk, too. What will all those Republicans thinking about supporting Obama -- the Obamicans, as he has started calling them -- say when they see Kennedy embracing him?

Then again, I bet that's a problem Clinton wishes she had today.

--Jonathan Cohn

Posted: Monday, January 28, 2008 1:53 AM with 47 comment(s)

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Eos said:

So Barak calls his Republican supporters Obamaicans? Another indication that he was deliberately  speaking positively about Reagan and Republican ideas as a strategic move draw them closer. It will be interesting to see how Kennedy plays. Not so clear who his national constituency is anymore. Is this the nostalgia card?

January 28, 2008 6:00 AM

lymon1 said:

Kennedy alone isn't important but keeping South Carolina momentum is, which is where all these endorsements planned over the week could be significant (that's why Hillary is unseemlying campaigning in Florida).  It's not Latinos but whites -- I don't see how Obama wins a general election if in a Dem primary he only pulls 30% of the white vote (Iowa caucuses and maybe Illinois aside).  But I don't see how Hillary wins a general election without a big African-American turnout.  I think the Dems are counting on a lack of enthusiasm among republicans but they may be eating themselves alive here.

January 28, 2008 6:35 AM

dcshungu said:

This Kennedy endorsement raises an issue that has been a subject of ongoing debate between Noam Scheiber and Michael Croweley: The role of Bill Clinton as the de facto Dem party leader (because Gore and Kerry failed to claim that mantle by losing to Bush), and as a surrogate for his wife. Why is it okay for someone with the political clout of Ted Kennedy to endorse Obama, but it is not kosher for Bill to be the no. 1 advocate for his wife? People feel that Bill gives Hillary an "unfair" advantage because he is such a political heavy-weight, but how about Kennedy or Kerry, for that matter, who came within one state of claiming the mantle of party leader? Are they chopped liver? The candidates are jockeying for any advantage that they can gain, and it is unfair and undemocratic to attempt to deprive Hillary of her natural advantage in Bill, HER HUSBAND. Some have suggested that Bill has been hurting Hillary's chances, but why is that a concern of the media? In fact, the only that has been hurting Hillary and Bill is the media's focus on finding fault with his involvement in her campaign (which I suspect is their whole purpose in raising this bogus issue). My feeling is that the media need to butt out and let this drama play itself out. If Obama prevails in the end, it would make him that much more a formidable general election candidate. So far, the press has seemed to be in the business of "protecting" Obama for the Clintons' "nastiness", another bogus narrative of their own creation. However,  I strongly believe that the media are depriving Obama of a golden opportunity for him to gain campaigning experience and political maturity that he would need to be able to compete in the general election against the legendary Atwater/Rove smear machine. You think that the Clintons have been "nasty"? You ain't seen nothing yet!

January 28, 2008 6:47 AM

BHLnyc said:

I think that every time one of their senate colleagues opts to endorse Obama over Clinton, it puts the lie to the idea that he doesn't have the gravitas to be president. Or that he won't be ready on Day One. These are the people who work most closely with both of them and are in the best position to asess their strengths and weaknesses. That they come to the conclusion that Obama is best suited to the office is important.

Whether or not Kennedy's backing by itself will mean much, I can't say. But it does add to the sense that the key endorsements are moving Obama's way and that seems significant, especially because so many are coming from "red" states and swing states, where electibility is a huge issue. These senators know that Hillary is too risky to keep these vital states in play.

January 28, 2008 7:21 AM

mroman said:

Bill Clinton has gone out of his way to try and marginalize Obama as the "black candidate". It's offensive and, given his supposed concern for the black community, hypocritical in the extreme. The objection to BC isn't that he's participating in the campaign, but rather that he is singlehandedly, whether on Hillary's instructions or not, dragging it down into the mud.

Edwards/Obama '08--the one ticket that can win

January 28, 2008 7:24 AM

BHLnyc said:

dcshungu, you're completely missing the point. It's not for the media to "butt out" when they see that our former president is making statements that are demonstrably false. When Clinton says that he was always against the Iraq War, that's an easily provable lie and fair game for the media. And when he then tries to distort Obama's position by suggesting that Obama did not always oppose the War, that too is a lie and again worthy of media coverage.

When Clinton prevaricates enough times, that becomes a news story in itself and suddenly everything he says is open for scrutiny. If he's embarrassed by what they find, too bad. Sorry, but that's the way news works.

January 28, 2008 7:32 AM

hewstino said:

<i>You think that the Clintons have been "nasty"? You ain't seen nothing yet!</i>

I've seen enough for a Democratic primary.  The Clintons  still have an opportunity to dismantle the Obama campaign without distorting his record or clumsily trying to use the senator's race against him.

The Clintons are not trying to toughen up Obama for the general election.  They intend him no favors.  They are trying to defeat him, and they seem at a loss with how to defeat him on substance.  They are also out of touch, having been surrounded by old friends and former employees for the past sixteen years.  That they have been unable to convince many Democratic establishment figures  to endorse them shows how out of touch they are.

This is just within their <i>own party</i>.  There is no telling how out of touch  they are with the country at large.  

January 28, 2008 8:06 AM

dcshungu said:

BHLnyc  said:

"dcshungu, you're completely missing the point. It's not for the media to "butt out" when they see that our former president is making statements that are demonstrably false."

No. You are missing the point. If Bill Clinton says something (out of thousands of comments) that is demonstrably false all the media needs to do is to set the record straight. The ongoing debate has been about whether or not it was kosher for Bill, being the de facto leader of the party, should inject himself in the race in support of his wife. Clinton won't be the first or the last politicians to try to raise doubt about an opponent. It is up to the opponent his/her surrogates or the media to set the record straight, which should be punishment enough for the prevaricator. That is not what the media has been concerned about. They feel that Bill is an unfair advantage for Hillary and must butt out.

Try again, but stay on topic this time. I have no need to defend Bill if all they are faulting him for is for making up things. If Obama cannot rebut Bill's purported lies, how can he be expected to respond to the Repub's legendary smear machine. Remember the "swiftbosters"? It was all lies about Kerry's record but all Kerry had to do was to respond, which he waited too long to do and then did  poorly when he got to it, and lost the election partially as a result. So I will repeat:

My feeling is that the media need to butt out and let this drama play itself out. If Obama prevails in the end, it would make him that much more formidable a general election candidate. So far, the press has seemed to be in the business of "protecting" Obama from the Clintons' "nastiness", another bogus narrative of their own creation. However,  I strongly believe that the media are depriving Obama of a golden opportunity for him to gain campaigning experience and political maturity that he would need to be able to compete in the general election against the legendary Atwater/Rove smear machine. You think that the Clintons have been "nasty"? You ain't seen nothing yet!

January 28, 2008 8:27 AM

dcshungu said:

hewstino  said:

"I've seen enough for a Democratic primary.  The Clintons  still have an opportunity to dismantle the Obama campaign without distorting his record or clumsily trying to use the senator's race against him."

So let Obama defend himself! There is cause to doubt most things that Obama claims but the media, having gone gaga over the guy, has abdicated duty and avoided scrutinizing Obama. Bill Clinton was right to characterize Obama's purported  "opposition" to the war as a "fairy tale". I have written ad nauseam about this. Here's the argument in a nutshell:

The claim is that Obama had "opposed' the Iraq war, but this claim is so full of hole that it wouldn't even be nominated for an award  for "profile in courage." In 2002, Obama was about to launch his candidacy for the Illinois US Senate seat and had to "oppose" the war or lose African-Americans, who had opposed the Iraq war from the get-go (African-American kids make up the overwhelming proportion of the US combat forces, and would suffer the disproportionate number of casualties), and whose vote he absolutely had to have in order to prevail. He had no choice but to come out against the war if he was  to win the nomination for the US Senate seat.  Having delivered his Principled Opposition to the War (TM) speech, Obama immediately began to distance himself from his purported "opposition" to the war. First, during the heady days of "Mission Accomplished", when support for the war reached its peak, some black reporters in Chicago noticed that Obama's famous speech "opposing" the war had conspicuously disappeared from his Senate campaign website, and that Obama was saying almost nothing about his "opposition" to the war. Then, after he got to the US Senate where he could finally substantively express his purported "opposition" to the war, Obama voted just like Hillary on every war funding bill that reached the senate floor. Do you see why an astute politician like Bill Clinton would be justified to characterize the whole canard as a "fairy tale"? Other than claiming to have "opposed" the war, there is nothing that Obama did, until he was about to run for POTUS, that supported his claim. Only a kool-aid drinker would whine that Obama's record is being distorted if anyone challenges his claim about having "opposed" the Iraq war. The press, already full of Obama kool-aid, gave him a pass on these glaring inconsistencies, so Bill got exasperated and raised the issue. Josh Marshall of TPM recently put this whole issue of whining by Obama and his supporters in very succinct language and I quote:

----

"As I told you at the time, I thought most of the charges that the Clintons were injecting race into the process were bogus. And the Obama campaign definitely tried to stoke questions about what were at worst awkward or ambiguous statements. What's more, most of the talk about venomous attacks on Obama really don't add up.

Bringing up Rezko or cherry-picking Obama's quotes about the Iraq War to cast doubt on his consistent opposition to the war don't cut it. You don't go into a campaign with the idea that your opponents are obligated to present a dispassionate and fair-minded picture of the totality of your record. Or if you do you're a fool. Maybe you think that it should be that way but I'm not even sure there's any point discussing that hypothetical. Fundamentally a campaign is an adversary process, like a courtroom; it's not a civics lesson. Each side puts the other to its test. And there's very little I've seen from the Clinton camp that would seem like anything but garden variety political hardball if it were coming from Hillary or other Clinton surrogates rather than Bill Clinton.

I hear from a lot of Obama supporters that that may be how it's been. But Obama is about the 'new politics'. But this is no different from what Bill Bradley was saying in 2000. And it was as bogus then as it is now. Beyond that there is an undeniable undercurrent in what you hear from Obama supporters that he is too precious a plant -- a generational opportunity for a transformative presidency -- to be submitted to this sort of knockabout political treatment. That strikes me as silly and arrogant, if for no other reason that the Republicans will not step aside for Obama's transcendence either."

------

I could not have said it better. Enjoy the kool-aid...

January 28, 2008 9:02 AM

ralphnelle said:

Call it kool-aid, but he sees him like this:

youtube.com/watch

January 28, 2008 9:08 AM

kgrant1054 said:

I am afraid that I don't believe that the Republicans are going to wheel out anything substantially more 'nasty' than what has been dragged out in the primary season.   Race?  Obama is a closet Muslim? Obama as the Manchurian candidate?  Past drug use (and maybe even past drug pushing, as already hinted at by one of Clinton's people in New Hampshire)?  Rezco the Slum-lord?  

Ok, so they move from whispering campaigns to overt campaigns - Is this not merely a matter of degree?  

Unless the Clinton supporters of this list (and many others) have proof of some new nastiness in the offing should Obama make the general election, I would begin to think that this line of reasoning is meant to do two things:  One, strike fear into the hearts of Democrats that yet again a candidate will be swift-boated, and so therefore we should steer clear of such a candidate.  Two, try to attempt to show that Obama and his supporters are simply not tough enough for the job, and will never be. It is the argument that somehow a Machiavellian willingness to do whatever is necessary to win (the true understanding of the ends justifying the means is really the heart of pragmatism - you do what you need to do to hold on to power or to win power - morality plays no part of the equation) is one of the criteria for a person running for President, trumping all others.  

Lastly, there seems to be a hint of unrestrained glee in the hearts of those who raise the claim, 'You ain't seen nothing yet!'  If Obama is the Democratic nominee, are you hoping that he gets destroyed by nastiness from the Republicans so that you can say, 'I told you so'?

January 28, 2008 9:15 AM

miceelf said:

dcshungu -

You seem to be the only one (with the possible exception of Crowley) who is treating this as an argument about whether Bill Clinton should be involved. No one is saying he shouldn't. Instead, he's being criticised for the way in which he's involved, which is dishonest and divisive.

And you seem to not want people to to criticze Bill Clinton for his behavior, while at the same time saying "let Obama defend himself"- so why can't Bill Clinton defend himself? And why can't people take the Clinton campagin's behavior into account in forming their impressions of the candidates?

January 28, 2008 9:42 AM

Robert Powell said:

Getting endorsed by people like Teddie and Kerry is a dead loser in November, as it should be, but it could help put Barak over the top on Feb 5.  I don't see anything wrong with the Clinton's pulling out all the stops--politics ain't beanbag.  But at the end of the day, Obama is the only candidate in either party who really understands what the voters are looking for this year. Whether or not he can deliver remains to be seen.

January 28, 2008 9:45 AM

BHLnyc said:

Sorry, dcshungu, but you're trying to do what so many Clintonites do, which is to set up a false argument. You say the following:

"The ongoing debate has been about whether or not it was kosher for Bill, being the de facto leader of the party, should inject himself in the race in support of his wife."

No one has objected to or questioned Bill Clinton's right to speak on behalf of his wife and I defy you to show me a single editorial or news story that has challenged that right. This is -- you'll pardon the expression -- a fairy tale that has been perpetuated by the Clinton team and their supporters because it takes the focus away from the real issue, which is his truthiness. Like it or not, when an ex-president lies, it's newsworthy, even if it's done on behalf of his wife.

If getting the facts out somehow "protects" Obama, so be it. At the end of the day, that says much better things about his campaign than hers.  

January 28, 2008 9:53 AM

Bukharin said:

The whining about Bill Clinton's purported behavior is as boorish as his behavior.  Until Barak Obama can demonstrate his ability to walk on water he ought to accept and his supporters expect criticism to come his way.  It really should be about the issues (no 'stupid' included).

January 28, 2008 10:09 AM

hewstino said:

dcshungu, your rollicking tale of Obama's secret support for the Iraq War in 2002 is pure conjecture.  And there are several reasons for wanting to finance the war after it had been initially launched, even if you didn't support it in the the first place.  Bush would have been even more disasterous getting out than he was going in.

kgrant1054 also makes a good point.  Plenty sleaze has already been tossed out in the last few weeks.  It's unlikely the Republicans will come up with much new, though they will surely expand on attacks we are already familiar with, and do so with more sophistication and deniability than we have seen from the relatively meat-fisted Clinton campaign.

And surely the Republican nominee will find a more effective way to use their spouse than Hillary Clinton has.

January 28, 2008 10:19 AM

thetraytiger said:

dcshungu,

No, you really are missing the point.  Kerry, Kennedy, and Daschle won't be sharing an Obama White House.

Bill Clinton, de facto party leader, doesn't just *happen* to be Hillary's husband. He'd be in the White House too.  That's a big difference.

January 28, 2008 10:56 AM

Daily Intelligencer - New York Magazine said:

Barack Obama came away from Saturday's shellacking of Hillary Clinton in South Carolina with more than a few delegates: Ted Kennedy, elder statesmen of liberal politics, is throwing his considerable heft (bloat?) behind Obama&#8217;s candidacy. And of

January 28, 2008 11:13 AM

lymon1 said:

One question for Obama supporters: complete the following sentance:

After enterring the senate with more buzz and political capital than any new senator in recent history, Obama championed the issue of _________, putting his reputation and popularity on the line.  (Or did he, like he did as a state senator, avoid anything more controversial than avian bird flu with a view to running for higher office?)

January 28, 2008 11:14 AM

dcshungu said:

thetraytiger  said:

"Bill Clinton, de facto party leader, doesn't just *happen* to be Hillary's husband. He'd be in the White House too.  That's a big difference."

So what is you point exactly? The only difference here is that you are not thinking.

Reductio ad absurdum: Should Hillary divorce Bill in order for her to exercise her constitutionally protected right to run for POTUS?

Some people are acting like real troglodytes... Third world countries would handle this sort of things much better, IMHO.

January 28, 2008 11:18 AM

dcshungu said:

miceelf  said:

"You seem to be the only one (with the possible exception of Crowley) who is treating this as an argument about whether Bill Clinton should be involved. No one is saying he shouldn't. Instead, he's being criticised for the way in which he's involved, which is dishonest and divisive."

That is politics! If Obama can't stand the heat, the kitchen door is wide open...

January 28, 2008 11:23 AM

Rhubarbs said:

Lymon: That's a fair question. How would a Hillary supporter answer it on behalf of one's candidate?

January 28, 2008 11:32 AM

jmurph79 said:

Come on.  He's a first-termer.  Show me successful senators that have put all of their political capital on the line in their first term.  

Also, as a state senator, he took on the death penalty and police interrogations.  Are those controversial enough for you?

January 28, 2008 11:33 AM

jmurph79 said:

dcshungu-

Here's what's disappointing- you're not even arguing with the fact that a former president has been dishonest while supporting another candidate and tearing down a member of his own party.  You're just saying, So, "that is politics!"  You don't see any problem there?

January 28, 2008 11:37 AM

miceelf said:

It appears to be Bill Clinton who is having trouble with the heat. "Taking the high road" while subtly drawing contrasts with your opponent is politics that works and Obama is good at it. The righteous anger and blatant race-baiting is the tactics of Alan Keyes and George Allen, respectively, and we know how that turned out.

January 28, 2008 11:37 AM

teplukhin2you said:

RObt P, Kerry, Kennedy et al now, and (maybe?) Colin Powell and his ilk in October.

January 28, 2008 11:37 AM

Rhubarbs said:

dcshungu said:

"Some people are acting like real troglodytes... Third world countries would handle this sort of things much better, IMHO."

Actually, the fact that a country has to deal with interfamily succession is one of the things that _makes it_ a third-world country. Yeah, Pakistani politics would probably do a better job of adjusting to a former president's wife running for office. And would you really prefer to be a citizen of Pakistan? That Lund Washington, Robert Lincoln, and Bess Truman were not considered for the presidency was a sign of the health of our republic in former times.

January 28, 2008 11:40 AM

BHLnyc said:

As a state senator, lymon1 might be reminded, Obama opposed a war that was still supported by a significant majority of Americans, including those in Illiniois, where he was preparing to run for the senate. That alone demonstrates that he has more courage than Mrs. Clinton, who voted in favor.

Another moment of bravery that comes to mind was when he went to Detroit in May and told the auto industry that they had to stop dragging their feet on better fuel efficiency. Sure everyone talks about it, but it was a pretty courageous act to go into the belly of the beast and tell these people to their faces something they didn't want to hear. Hillary would never have done anything that brave for fear of damaging her chances in the Michigan primary.

January 28, 2008 11:53 AM

dcshungu said:

jmurph79  said:

"Here's what's disappointing- you're not even arguing with the fact that a former president has been dishonest while supporting another candidate and tearing down a member of his own party.  You're just saying, So, "that is politics!"  You don't see any problem there?"

You are hung up on this "former president" stuff.  I am not. In fact, "former" should the operating word. . Bill Clinton is the "leader" of the party today because no other Dem has succeeded in claiming that mantle, so it has been pinned on him BY DEFAULT for the last office 8 years (which is actually pathetic if you think about it).  But what if he no longer wishes to be the party leader? Can you force him? No. But that is exactly what some of you seem to be determined to do! His wife is running for POTUS and he has every right to go out and  support her, including doing politics as usual. The level incoherence just betrays the fact that none of those pontificating  have a clue about how to deal with these uncharted waters. When in doubt, err on the side of individual liberty. Bill Clinton is a private citizen who deserves to have the same right as anyone, including supporting his wife's bid for the highest office of the land, and engaging in mud-wrestling if that is what he thinks would help his wife. If it hurts her, that is their concern, none of yours!!!

January 28, 2008 12:06 PM

dcshungu said:

BHLnyc  said:

"As a state senator, lymon1 might be reminded, Obama opposed a war that was still supported by a significant majority of Americans, including those in Illiniois, where he was preparing to run for the senate. That alone demonstrates that he has more courage than Mrs. Clinton, who voted in favor."

Fairy tale...

January 28, 2008 12:07 PM

cypess said:

A question for you Clinton defenders out there - I've heard a lot about how Obama isn't tough enough to withstand the Republicans because he's not been tough enough to handle the Clintons.  Except that Obama *has* endured the Clinton's mud-slinging.  Two of the biggest figures in the Democratic party have been throwing everything (kitchen sink and all) at Obama, and the net result is a continued climb in the state and national polls, increased voter turnout, and a 'rout' in South Carolina.

The Clintons on the other hand, despite their claim that they can endure the Republican slime machine, seem to have lost their cool many many times. Bill's finger wagging is just one case out of many.  The attempt to disenfranchise voters in Nevada.  The attempt to overturn the DNC ruling about Florida and Michigan.  These are nakedly desperate actions.  

If anybody has shown that he/she can withstand attacks with cool aplomb, it's been Obama.  

So, to reverse the favorite phrase of Clinton supporters.  If you think that Barack Obama has been tough, just wait until the GOP gets in the fight!  

January 28, 2008 12:33 PM

dcshungu said:

hewstino  said:

"dcshungu, your rollicking tale of Obama's secret support for the Iraq War in 2002 is pure conjecture."

There  are contemporaneous accounts of the situation at the time when Obama came out against the war. I know nothing about his secret support for the war. I just contended that his purported "opposition" to the war was stuff of "fairy tales" and not a "profile in courage". Cynical political calculation and opportunism, pure and simple.

Bruce Dixon, a black Chicago report, who had worked with Obama in the early 90s on voters registration drive and community outreach, ought to know because he was there. Here's what Dixon had written back in June 2003, long before Obama was the anointed "messiah" (support for the following is provided by the fact that Obama gad responded to Dixon [see at bottom of this post]):

link to what follows: www.blackcommentator.com/.../45_dixon.html

---------------------------

Barack Obama, a constitutional law professor and state senator from the south side of Chicago, is a leading candidate for the US Senate in the March 2004 Illinois Democratic primary. It's an open seat with no incumbent. In a crowded field that includes three well-known and better-funded opponents, Obama is definitely a contender. But who is Barack Obama?

A former community organizer not long out of Harvard Law School, Obama was tapped in 1992 to head up Project VOTE Illinois, where he was responsible for registering 120,000 new Democratic voters, mostly minorities, and chasing the greater part of them out to the polls that November. Barack and his team made a significant contribution toward Bill Clinton carrying Illinois that year and enabled Carol Moseley Braun to squeak by a Republican opponent to become the first and only black woman ever to sit in the US Senate. In 1996 Obama was elected to the Illinois state senate. At the midpoint of a four-year term in 2000, Obama challenged incumbent congressman Bobby Rush and was trounced in the Democratic primary by almost 2 to 1. He is the sponsor of a bill in the Illinois legislature requiring local police departments in Illinois to record the race of anyone stopped for questioning so that the data can be used to track the occurrence of racial profiling.

Energizing the base

To win the Democratic primary election in Illinois, where African Americans cast at least a quarter of the ballots, Obama needs to capture the great majority of a large black turnout, and pick up a significant slice of white votes as well. To secure a general election victory in a presidential election year Obama will have to fire up an expanded Democratic base and turn the election into a crusade against the incumbent president and his party. Can he do it?

At an antiwar meeting last October Obama was certainly pitching to that Democratic base in the progressive and African American community:

   "I don't oppose all wars ... What I am opposed to is a dumb war. What I am opposed to is a rash war. What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz and other arm-chair, weekend warriors in this Administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne.

   "What I am opposed to is the attempt by political hacks like Karl Roves to distract us from a rise in the uninsured, a rise in the poverty rate, a drop in the median income ... to distract us from corporate scandals and a stock market that has just gone thru the worst month since the Great Depression.

   "That's what I'm opposed to. A dumb war. A rash war. A war based not on reason but on passion, not on principle but on politics .... "

Somebody else's brand of politics appears to have intruded on Obama's campaign. For a while the whole speech could be found on Obama's campaign web site, a key statement of principle for a serious US Senate candidate in an election season when the President's party threatens the world with permanent war and pre-emptive invasion, and cows US citizens with fear mongering, color coded alerts, secret detentions and the abrogation of constitutional liberties. Although Obama may have appeared at meetings of other citizens opposed to the war or let them use his name, no further public statements from the candidate on these important issues have appeared.

Then, a few weeks ago, Barack Obama's heartfelt statement of principled opposition to lawless militarism and the rule of fear was stricken without explanation from his campaign web site, and replaced with mild expressions of "anxiety":

   But I think [people are] all astonished, I think, in many quarters, about, for example, the recent Bush budget and the prospect that, for example, veterans benefits might be cut. And so there's discussion about that, I think, among both supporters and those who are opposed to the war. What kind of world are we building?

--------------------------------------

Obama had, in fact, responded to Dixon:

www.blackcommentator.com/.../45_dixon.html

Key graph explaining why his famous speech "opposing" the war had disappeared from his Senate campaign website:

-------------------------

"The only reason that my original anti-war speech was removed from my website was a judgment that the speech was dated once the formal phase of the war was over, and my staff's desire to continually provide fresh news clips. "

-------------------------

Imagine that! How much storage space would it have required for Obama to keep his Principled Opposition to the War (TM) speech on his website at a time when America was engaged in a war that he had "opposed"? If you buy his explanation, then I have very cheap duplexes to sell you on Park Avenue!

January 28, 2008 12:38 PM

miceelf said:

poor dcshungu-

Even if all of what you say is true, and Obama was a craven, dishonest coward, he was still more courageous than Sen. Clinton.

January 28, 2008 1:41 PM

lymon1 said:

To L:  As I've written repeatedly, Obama's stance against the war should be viewed against the backdrop of when he anounced it.  He was running 3rd in the Dem primary (he won because the front-runner imploded in a divorce scandal) and he comes from a very lefty state senate district.  I'm not saying it doesn't deserve credit, but 1) it should be taken with a grain of salt and 2) his statement that he'll pull troops even if a genocide takes place in Iraq as a result doesn't reflect good "judgment" to me.  

To J:  Asked you first!  I'd have said her misguided vote on consumer bankruptcy reform (at least she has been up front about it, as opposed to Obama's voting-for-discharge-and-claiming-he-was-against-it doubletalk), but in one of the debates she's reversed herself.  But my argument with Obama isn't Clinton is better (to repeat, I'm not supporting her), but that Obama's not different.  

To me, Obama's biggest hypocricy is here in Chicago.  He had numerous chances to back reform candidates but instead has stayed loyal to an extremely corrupt machine even though it would not have imperiled his reelection bid.  It's particularly bad given Mayor Daley's involvement in the city's biggest police torture scandal (first as state's attorney, then as mayor).  He also could have been far more vocal when the 2006 ethics bill in Congress was being dilluted (I won't say gutted b/c there's a few good things in it).  

January 28, 2008 1:49 PM

stgla said:

I have another take on why Kennedy's endorsement matters. It's because it's the most convincing way to legitimize Obama's implicit claim to be the political heir of JFK.  It's significant that the endorsement is a family affair.  And of course Caroline was fairly explicit.

January 28, 2008 1:57 PM

jm_rice said:

With all due respect to the Kennedys and Skakels, their comparisons of Obama to JFK are utter bullshit.  Unlike Obama, JFK addresssed substantive and controversial issues as a candidate. One example, among many:  against Nixon and a potent China Lobby, JFK opposed fighting mainland China over the islands of Quemoy and Matsu, which were claimed by Taiwan, because the islands were, in his word, "indefensible".  At the time this was a hot issue.  Would I imagine John McCain with this kind of savvy?  Yes.  Would I imagine Mitt Romney with this kind of savvy?  Yes.  Hillary Clinton?  Yes.  On the other hand, every time Obama tries to speak to major foreign or domestic policy issues he puts his foot in it, or he comes out with some smarmy, unresponsive Kumbaya nonsense.  The pitiful mindset of BO support is illustrated by someone's offering up his principled stand on police misconduct in Illinois (He was against it) as proof of his "gravitas".

One signal quality I've noticed among Obama supporters is the utter fatuousness of their rationale.  "He can bring us together...he's so sincere...he's for change...he's another JFK."  It's as if they're willfully oblivious to the fact that on substantive issues this guy is a cipher.  And apparenlty the Kennedys are no exception.

There is fan psychology at work here -- uncritical, irrational, almost mob-like.  Thanks to George W. Bush, 2008 should be a sweep for the Democrats.  However, hubris has taken over, and once again the party have deluded themselves into thinking that in the voter's mind an un-Bush automatically means a Democrat; November will prove how dismally wrongheaded they are.  Having shed their only viable candidates in favor of a novelty candidate, the disco that is the Democratic party continues to barrel ahead.  But hey, it's Saturday night, and the whole world is gay.  Who cares about Monday morning, when we're having so much fun!

January 28, 2008 2:39 PM

dcshungu said:

miceelf  said:

"Even if all of what you say is true, and Obama was a craven, dishonest coward, he was still more courageous than Sen. Clinton."

If what I am saying is true, then it just means that you have had too much kool-aid and cannot even recognize its obvious elevance t to the ongoing debate: It would mean that the whining about Bill distorting Obama's record is dishonesty on the party of his detractors and not Bill's...like you! Got it, poor MiceElf?

January 28, 2008 3:17 PM

jm_rice said:

It just occured to me why Obama is getting so many inside-the-beltway endorsements (Teddy, Leahy, Pelosi through her surrogate George Brown):  it's an institutional thing.  Just as the GOP Congress made the executive branch irrelevant (except for 9/11, unfiortunately) when a moron became president, a Democratic Congress will do the same with Obama.  In him they see a callow neophyte, who will not, cannot, make a move without the "guidance" of the mandarins.  Despite her cordial relations in the current Senate, Hillary is still burdened, I believe, by the institutional memory of the Clintons' early 1990s heathcare fiasco, which largely came about by Hillary's co-opting what Congress regarded as their prerogatives.  Given the morass of special interests which keep meaningful healthcare reform problematic, Congress richly deserved being sidestepped.  But, alas, not only is Congress techy and petty but thier institutional memory is long.  The Democratic Congressional mandarins see in Hillary the prospect of an executive branch far less pliable than they do in Obama.  What Kennedy et al. are saying is not so much "Barack Obama inspires us" as "Come into our parlour..."

January 28, 2008 3:35 PM

cbobmoats said:

The mantle was passed after South Carolina.  Many before have tried to inherit the heir of JFK and RFK.  Michael Dukakis, Joe Biden, John Kerry, and even Bill Clinton and many others have used the Kennedy memory in their favor and attempted to channel it into their own political image.  This is perhaps the first instance where the true Kennedy heirs have passed along their movement to an outsider.  This endorsement is significant not only because it was given, but being that it is early in the process in the heat of a very competitive primary.  

For the first time since 1980, Kennedy is taking an active role in suggesting who the nominee needs to be.  Perhaps this will mean little to most voters, but I think the exposure and the visual of the Kennedy family standing on stage with Obama will present a powerful image to many Democrats across the country.  Many Democrats are not enthusiastic about Clinton being the nominee but are not ready to committ to Obama just yet.  This endorsement and image might be enough to place them in Obama's camp.  

January 28, 2008 5:12 PM

The Plank said:

Contra Jonathan Cohn , I don&#39;t see how Ted Kennedy&#39;s endorsement will actually help Barack Obama

January 28, 2008 6:38 PM

bcbaird said:

Why is it all the staff comments get cut off after one line?  They make no sense!

"Contra Jonathan Cohn , I don&#39;t see how Ted Kennedy&#39;s endorsement will actually help Barack Obama"

See?!

January 28, 2008 10:01 PM

timcrim said:

dcshungu,

Your analysis of Obama's record on Iraq is narrow and tendentious.

First, Obama could have won the Democratic primary without giving such an impassioned anti-war speech. If he believed that he would have to pivot on the issue once he secured the nomination, it made no sense for him to lard his speech with anger and contempt. If he merely expressed misgivings about the war and put a statement on his website, I suspect he still would have won the primary.

Second, you are leaping from Bruce Dixon's article into a non sequitur. If Obama's opposition to the war benefited him in the 2004 primary, it does not follow that his opposition was pure calculation and lacking in personal feeling.

Third, you are collapsing a crucial distinction by claiming that Obama was "inconsistent."

Here is Lawrence Lessig:

Here's the point to keep in view: Whatever your view about whether the war was right or wrong, how you vote after we entered the war is a different question from whether the war should have been waged in the first place. Ask Howard Dean, the last consistent opponent to the war. He didn't plan to cut funding to the troops, and pull out immediately. That's because, once the mistake was made, we had to deal with the mistake. So the fact Obama didn't vote to cut funding, or said he agreed with the way Bush was waging the war, is not "inconsistency." It is a different answer to a different question.

Don't belittle the credit one deserves for doing what Obama did in 2002. Whether or not he was contemplating running for President, no doubt he understood that opposing the war hysteria of the time would weaken his chances politically. That's the same understanding Clinton, Edwards, and every Republican had. But of the leading candidates, only Obama served us, by opposing an unjust war.

And regarding the "facts" in the attack: (1) Obama's first website in his candidacy for the Senate stated his opposition to the war. (2) The "2002 speech" referred to was a speech at an anti-war rally in Chicago. I don't know what Clinton could mean by saying it was "off his website." As you can see here, the "website" of a State Senator doesn't seem to have a place for speeches. The U.S. Senate campaign site, launched in 2002, does have a copy of the speech in the "news" section. That format continued for a time into 2003, but changed in 2003. But throughout 2003, Obama continued to promote the fact that "was the only Illinois senate candidate to publicly oppose President Bush's plan to pre-emptively attack Iraq." (3) Nothing in the original speech or in anything I've seen from that time indicates to me Obama promised to vote to cut off spending in Iraq. Instead, his promises then seem just as sensible now. This is from his website, December 2003:

Now that our troops are in Iraq, Obama will work toward ending deception that has shrouded our policies and forging international coalitions to share the burden of rebuilding. Obama will push for a full investigation of the intelligence provided to the Administration regarding the existence of Weapons of Mass Destruction and Iraqi efforts to obtain nuclear materials. He will also fight the cronyism and secret bidding that has resulted in billions of dollars in contracts going to large corporations close to the Administration. Obama will strive to restore truth and transparency to our policy in Iraq.

So essentially every important charge in the Clinton Swiftboating here is false. Aka, "swiftboating."

January 29, 2008 4:42 AM

Robert Powell said:

Obama is the rightful heir to the JFK "legacy" for the reasons outlined by jm_rice--that legacy is largely blue smoke and mirrors.  Actually, I think it's entirely likely that Obama would be a lot more serious-minded and substantive than JFK was. In any case, it seems increasingly plausable that the "Democrat Disco" will throw up a novelty candidate in large part due to hubris--they think this is an election they can't lose because, like Pauline Kael, everyone they know hates the Republicans. If the grownups in that party manage to nominate McCain/Huckabee, I think Dems are in for an unpleasant surprise. If it comes down to a race between Obama and The Rombot, "None of the Above" looks like the big winner.

January 29, 2008 4:56 AM

Eos said:

Following is the scathing statement from the New York Chapter of the National Organization of Women regarding Kennedy's endorsement:

“Women have just experienced the ultimate betrayal. Senator Kennedy’s endorsement of Hillary Clinton’s opponent in the Democratic presidential primary campaign has really hit women hard. Women have forgiven Kennedy, stuck up for him, stood by him, hushed the fact that he was late in his support of Title IX, the ERA, the Family Leave and Medical Act to name a few. Women have buried their anger that his support for the compromises in No Child Left Behind and the Medicare bogus drug benefit brought us the passage of these flawed bills. We have thanked him for his ardent support of many civil rights bills, BUT women are always waiting in the wings.

“And now the greatest betrayal! We are repaid with his abandonment! He’s picked the new guy over us. He’s joined the list of progressive white men who can’t or won’t handle the prospect of a woman president who is Hillary Clinton (they will of course say they support a woman president, just not “this” one).

:

January 29, 2008 7:07 AM

dcshungu said:

timcrim  said:

"dcshungu,

Your analysis of Obama's record on Iraq is narrow and tendentious.

First, Obama could have won the Democratic primary without giving such an impassioned anti-war speech. If he believed that he would have to pivot on the issue once he secured the nomination, it made no sense for him to lard his speech with anger and contempt. If he merely expressed misgivings about the war and put a statement on his website, I suspect he still would have won the primary.

Second, you are leaping from Bruce Dixon's article into a non sequitur. If Obama's opposition to the war benefited him in the 2004 primary, it does not follow that his opposition was pure calculation and lacking in personal feeling."

Years before, Obama had run for the OS senate and gotten trounced 2-1, therefore it is not at all sure that he could have won without giving such  an "impassioned" speech. If everyone would agree on one thing about Obama is that he has a way with words, and can give a good speech! But

other than for his speech "opposing" the war, Obama did absolutely nothing substantive that showed that his purported "opposition" was a statement of principle and not cynical political opportunism and calculation [especially if you recall Obama's earlier loss AND the African-Americans genuine opposition to the war]. When Kucinich says that he has opposed the war, there no doubt that he has: He voted against the invasion AND also against every war funding bill in the House. That is a principled opposition, Lessig's view notwithstanding.. Obama "opposed" the war in words, but then immediately distanced himself from it in deeds: speech disappearing from website, moratorium on speaking about the war, getting caught saying that he was not sure how he would have voted had he been in the Senate at the time, but then voting repeatedly to perpetuate the war by funding it, once he got to the Senate. Obama talks the talk but seldom walks the walk. Any fair-minded person would not characterize scrutiny of Obama inconsistent history of his was position as "distorting it."  IMHO, it seems like "fairy tale."

January 29, 2008 7:44 AM

The Plank said:

For those missed the first few minutes of the debate, an early question from Jeanne Cummings went to

January 31, 2008 10:02 PM

Jonathan Cohn - whereIstand.com said:

April 1, 2008 9:46 AM